Damn Ignition, but I can start her from under the hood!!! • The Dodge Challenger Message Board

by **RedRaven** » 15 Jul 2007 20:17

Hi All,
Im new here and would like to pick your Mopar brains with this one.

Im having problems starting my 1970 baby.. the problem is the ignition...I can start her when I touch some wiring together under the hood and hold the key in the start position..but if I want to keep her running I have to hold it in that position or she cuts out, its driving me insane..please help!!!

by **jh27n0b** » 15 Jul 2007 22:48

Welcome RedRaven

What wires are you touching together to get the engine to start?

Usually it is a bad ballast resistor when a mopar will run when the key is in the start position but dies as soon as the key is in the run position.

Does the engine turn over with the key or do you have to jumper accross the starter relay on the inner fender to get the engine to crank?

Bob

by **RedRaven** » 15 Jul 2007 23:17

Hey Bob Thanks for the reply,
Its a bit hard to explain, but there is a cluster of wiring just beside the battery on the inside of the front left fender and when you contact one particular wire off the bolt just above it the engine turns over and if somebody holds the key in the start position gives it some juice and holds the key there she burbles away no problem..but as soon and you let go of the key to the run position she cuts out.

I will take a picture of the wiring set up I mentioned this might help I guess, any help is most appreciated guys!!!

jh27n0b wrote:Welcome RedRaven

What wires are you touching together to get the engine to start?

Usually it is a bad ballast resistor when a mopar will run when the key is in the start position but dies as soon as the key is in the run position.

Does the engine turn over with the key or do you have to jumper accross the starter relay on the inner fender to get the engine to crank?

Bob

by **jh27n0b** » 15 Jul 2007 23:52

Hey RedRaven

The metal box that all of those wires bolt onto is the starter relay. I had the exact same problem with my Challenger earlier this year. My solution was to go to my local NAPA dealer and buy a new starter relay. Not %100 sure that this is your problem but it fixed mine.

Still sounds like your Ballast resister is also bad. It is the white ceramic rectangular block on the firewall right next to the wiper motor.

These are cheap and common parts to replace.

It still could be in your wiring harness or your ignition switch. Not as cheap and much harder to replace.

Can we have more detailes on your 70 baby?

Good luck and keep us posted.

Bob

by **dave-r** » 16 Jul 2007 8:01

Another common fault is simply a bad connection on the bulkhead connector. They are very prone to bad connections there.

So check that out before buying new parts.

There is also a connector in the wires from the steering column. So check that as well.

by **RedRaven** » 16 Jul 2007 10:25

Hi,
Ok so I think I will order those parts you suggested and see what happens....My challenger is a 1970 R/T with a 727 torq tranny and a 383 Magnum...its sublime green also....Shes an Angel and it hurts me to see her not at her best!!!!

Thanks for your help....I will keep you posted on how it goes when I drop in those new parts.

jh27n0b wrote:Hey RedRaven

The metal box that all of those wires bolt onto is the starter relay. I had the exact same problem with my Challenger earlier this year. My solution was to go to my local NAPA dealer and buy a new starter relay. Not %100 sure that this is your problem but it fixed mine.

Still sounds like your Ballast resister is also bad. It is the white ceramic rectangular block on the firewall right next to the wiper motor.

These are cheap and common parts to replace.

It still could be in your wiring harness or your ignition switch. Not as cheap and much harder to replace.

Can we have more detailes on your 70 baby?

Good luck and keep us posted.

Bob

by **dave-r** » 16 Jul 2007 10:32

dave-r wrote:Another common fault is simply a bad connection on the bulkhead connector. They are very prone to bad connections there.

So check that out before buying new parts.

There is also a connector in the wires from the steering column. So check that as well.

by **RedRaven** » 16 Jul 2007 12:34

Hi Dave,
Thanks for your reply,
As you can imagine I am a bit frustrated with this so Im really thankful for all the help I can get...I see your not a million miles away in the U.K., Im just across the water in Ireland...so what you drivin mate??

Would you recommend year one to source parts from?

Cheers Wayne.

dave-r wrote:Another common fault is simply a bad connection on the bulkhead connector. They are very prone to bad connections there.

So check that out before buying new parts.

There is also a connector in the wires from the steering column. So check that as well.

by **dave-r** » 16 Jul 2007 13:44

RedRaven wrote:so what you drivin mate??

http://challenger.mpoli.fi/forum/viewto ... tid=Dave-R

Would you recommend year one to source parts from?

They are more expensive than the rest but are very good to deal with. I only use them for hard to find restoration parts.

There are also many good parts suppliers in the UK for normal run of the mill stuff. If you are not a member of the Mopar Muscle Association you should be as it will make your life much easier. :wink2:

by **RedRaven** » 16 Jul 2007 14:17

Hey Dave,
Im now a memeber of the M.M.A......Man I love PayPal HaHa.....So where to next Dave...Ive just checked out the rest of this site man its endless info...great stuff indeed!!!

o

dave-r wrote:
RedRaven wrote:so what you drivin mate??

http://challenger.mpoli.fi/forum/viewto ... tid=Dave-R

Would you recommend year one to source parts from?

They are more expensive than the rest but are very good to deal with. I only use them for hard to find restoration parts.

There are also many good parts suppliers in the UK for normal run of the mill stuff. If you are not a member of the Mopar Muscle Association you should be as it will make your life much easier.

by **dave-r** » 16 Jul 2007 14:47

Ask to join the MMA message board.

It is rather like this one but is better for local parts sourcing and contacting other members near yourself. I have a feeling there are one or two other Irish members if I remember right (only a slim chance of that ever happening :roll:

)
There are various traders that are MMA members too so you can get parts or even mechanical help if you need it. Sixpackspeedshop in Europe are getting very large now and their prices are very competative.
http://www.six-packspeedshop.be/ (website not finished yet)

Plus most of us all meet up at Santa Pod Raceway at the end of July every year. Just to show off and race each other. :mrgreen:

by **fbernard** » 16 Jul 2007 16:44

dave-r wrote: Just to show off and race each other.

At the local pub :s003:

by **RedRaven** » 18 Jul 2007 16:03

Hi Dave,

Just to let you know I checked out the MMA message board...man I gotta say between both of these site what a wealth of knowledge on mopars its amazing the stuff you guys know, I check out this particular one on a steering column rebuild holy (deleted) it rocked ...photo city!!!

Anyway I ordered those parts that I might need along with some gaskets and other bits like a nice pair of mopar stamped valve covers....

I will keep you posted on my progress.....like it or not I think you have a padwin leaner on your hands... Dave R(Mopar Jedi) ha ha....

No seriously thanks for the direction most appreciated mate.

I might try and make it to Santa Pod to soak up the MOPARNESS of it all!!!

dave-r wrote:Ask to join the MMA message board.

It is rather like this one but is better for local parts sourcing and contacting other members near yourself. I have a feeling there are one or two other Irish members if I remember right (only a slim chance of that ever happening )
There are various traders that are MMA members too so you can get parts or even mechanical help if you need it. Sixpackspeedshop in Europe are getting very large now and their prices are very competative.
http://www.six-packspeedshop.be/ (website not finished yet)

Plus most of us all meet up at Santa Pod Raceway at the end of July every year. Just to show off and race each other.

by **dave-r** » 18 Jul 2007 16:17

Us Mopar people have to look out for each other.

I deleted the expletive in your message. They are a bit funny about bad language in some countries and we don't want to offend people. :wink2:

by **fbernard** » 18 Jul 2007 18:27

dave-r wrote:I deleted the expletive in your message. They are a bit funny about bad language in some countries and we don't want to offend people.

Oh dear! It appears we may have slipped in the Moparts version of the board... :s009:

by **dave-r** » 18 Jul 2007 18:45

Yeah I know... :roll:

But I do get complaints if any f'in and blim'in or any ladies nipples (men's are OK apparently) get in. :lol:

However I refuse to actually set up the automatic censor. Even if it is actually fun (for ten minutes) thinking up and entering all the swear words that anyone could possibly come up with. :lol2:

by **RedRaven** » 18 Jul 2007 20:34

Yes your feckin right there your honor!!!;)

dave-r wrote:Us Mopar people have to look out for each other.

I deleted the expletive in your message. They are a bit funny about bad language in some countries and we don't want to offend people.

by **RedRaven** » 11 Aug 2007 21:29

Right so Ive replaced the starter relay and the ballast resistor, I just go to blolt on the starter motor and hopefully that will do it..

...As I said previously I could start her from under the hood but the problem was she cut out when the key went from start position to run position.

I want to test the starter before I bolt it on, Dave it is posible to test it off the battery with some jump leads yes?

by **dave-r** » 11 Aug 2007 22:04

If you like.

I doubt you will have cured the original problem though.

by **dave-r** » 11 Aug 2007 22:09

Did you measure your original ballast resistor to see if it was open circuit?

I bet the answer is no.

Did you test the starter relay?

I bet that is a no as well?

Fingers crossed one of those was the problem. But just chucking good money away replacing parts you have no idea are broken or not is NOT the way to find a fault. Unless you have the luck of the Irish of course. :wink:

Your money would have been better spent on a volt/ohm meter and your time better spent on reading the instructions for it.

Did you ever check the bulkhead connector that the wires from the ignition switch pass through? :s021:

by **RedRaven** » 11 Aug 2007 23:19

Hey Dave,
Yes I stuck my head under the the steering column and all seems to be connected ok I think.... Im still abit green as I dont really know what Im looking at, but if its loose I just reconnect.

dave-r wrote:Did you measure your original ballast resistor to see if it was open circuit?

I bet the answer is no.

Did you test the starter relay?

I bet that is a no as well?

Fingers crossed one of those was the problem. But just chucking good money away replacing parts you have no idea are broken or not is NOT the way to find a fault. Unless you have the luck of the Irish of course.

Your money would have been better spent on a volt/ohm meter and your time better spent on reading the instructions for it.

Did you ever check the bulkhead connector that the wires from the ignition switch pass through?

by **dave-r** » 12 Aug 2007 10:32

The bulkhead connector isn't under the dash. :roll:

by **dave-r** » 12 Aug 2007 10:41

If you look under the hood at where the steering column comes through the bulkhead you will see a big plastic thing with lots of wires going into it.

This is actually the back of the fuse box and is known as the bulkhead connector. All the wires in the engine bay plug into this connector block.

What happens is that with age the connections get bad.

I don't mean LOOSE. I mean tranished or even burn't. Bad connections in these plugs (no I don't mean loose) cause many electrical problems and is the first place to look for any.

It could also be your ignition switch that is faulty. That can happen.

The other bits you have bought replacements for are easy to check to see if they are faulty or not.

Any electrical problem is best traced using a volt meter. Put one lead to chassis and use the other lead to trace where the volts stop.

by **Eddie** » 12 Aug 2007 16:45

Wayne whats the status on your electrical problem? Do you have a Volt/ohm meter yet or a simple analog meter? A test light even? You gotta get one of those man and as Dave says, learn how to use it. It's very easy and once you "get it" with simple electrical problems it becomes fun to test stuff!(not that kind of fun, not anymore). :s009:

by **RedRaven** » 13 Aug 2007 21:49

Its in hand Eddie... Im slowly putting together a workshop of tools!!!;)

Bought a sweet 4 ton jack.....new inspection lamp...its addictive...might try to pick up some snap on tools soon!!!

airfuelEddie wrote:Wayne whats the status on your electrical problem? Do you have a Volt/ohm meter yet or a simple analog meter? A test light even? You gotta get one of those man and as Dave says, learn how to use it. It's very easy and once you "get it" with simple electrical problems it becomes fun to test stuff!(not that kind of fun, not anymore).

by **Eddie** » 13 Aug 2007 23:27

Glad to hear it Wayne. I go to the Tool Store,(Harbor freight Best damn Chinese tools made) :lol:

every week, it seems I'm always in need of adapters, sockets that have been misplaced or lost, broken ratchets ect... Sears Craftsman for my "good stuff" and when I want to get serious.. Snap On or MAC Tools but they are pricey! Chrysler used Miller tools during the "era" and they are good quality as well. I can get a Chinese Socket set 3/8 drive 9 sizes for 12.99!! One Sears Deep Well 3/8 drive 9/16 size socket is 8.99! :thumbsup:

by **dave-r** » 14 Aug 2007 7:37

You will get there in the end Wayne. Don't mind me pushing you. I should have been a Sgt Major in the Army. :twisted:

by **RedRaven** » 14 Aug 2007 22:12

I hear ya brother!!!
:thumbsup:

Oh and I appreciate the pushing..its good training...if you didnt push Id take it you didnt give a S**T what I did with my car!!!

dave-r wrote:You will get there in the end Wayne. Don't mind me pushing you. I should have been a Sgt Major in the Army.

by **dave-r** » 15 Aug 2007 7:58

I care.

by **RedRaven** » 15 Aug 2007 10:51

A Heart the size of a 440!!!

dave-r wrote:I care.