Introducing me and my Challenger
Posted: 25 Mar 2002 0:58Hi all,
I have posted twice last august about a Challenger I considered to buy (Technical/transmission/not so technical, thread about rpm) , but never really introduced myself and my car on this marvellous forum. (ok you can skip the personal part, and scroll to the Challenger part if you wish).
My name is Robbert, and have had this thing for cars since I was 18 months old. (This is serious!) I was a special attraction at birthdays, since it was so nice for the uncles and nephews to take me out and let me point out and name the cars in the streets. (My family says that out of the first 200 words I spoke 100 were car-related). In those years, since I was born in 19**, the streets in the Netherlands were rather scarcely populated with small and economical cars. Opel, Volkswagen, Fiat, Renault, (German and English) •••• (sorry, "furd"-wurd) , Simca, and others ruled the streets. When my father bought our first car it was a Beetle. The third car in our street, were now you can find maybe 50 cars. Cars were for transportation, performance for most people was a non-issue. Still I was fascinating by them. Remember there were no Japanese cars, and the different breeds were of very different build. In looks and technique. When I was 8, I could tell a dozen of cars only from hearing their engine, horn or even their doors closing. (for instance a Fiat 600, NSU 1200, and a Simca 1000 were all air cooled 4 cylinder cars, but I could still distinguish them. Opel, Renault, Fiat, no problem. And the only diesel engines in those days were Mercedes or Peugeot). Nowadays it is hard to hear the difference between most cars.
As I grew older an uncle of mine took me for a ride in his Rover V8 3500. Now this was something different. This ride made eager for power and speed. This was wat I would buy if I would be old enough! The rumble of the V8 added a new feeling of exitement. It made that I started to dream about cars. I mean in my sleep. (I still do, last night I dreamed about a ride in my Chally after having installed a shift kit...). Later I rode more and faster cars, but nothing exited me more than a big V8. Then one day I saw the Vanishing Point...
Chally
To make a long story short, after other cars (and motorcycles and, another passion that fights for my attention but is worsted after I decided to go for the real wheels. Not to mention girls, also very time consuming.) I fell in love with (since seeing Vanishing Point!) and started seriously looking for my dreamcar: a nice Dodge Challenger. Now nice ones were not easy to find! After more than a year I allmost decided to give it up and go for other Muscle… But then I came across this 1970 Challenger. It was a nice car, with nice options and its original rebuilt 383 and a lot of other work completed. Quite some parts and books came with it, the previous owner had decided to leave Europe.
The previous owner, who owned the car for about 2 and a half year, could not hand me over the build sheet, and the fender tag appeared to be missing since the last paint job! (The owner before him owned the car for 10 years without driving it). So I will be keeping a lookout for previous owners of Challengers, maybe this man is keeping it as a trophy, there were times it was not so much an issue… The owner stated the car is very much orinal, exept for wheels, hood, and mirrors. 99.000km (some 60.000 miles). Engine and tranny have 1970 #s indeed.
France
The car is of rare origin: The car is assembled in France. All information I have got about this is from hearsay:
- All Alpine White.
- They have a strange VIN code number, without the letters. The Fender tags were not in the same color as the inner fender but in plain aluminum. (could have been a reason to remove the tag before painting it). It also said: “Made in France”
- All with the same (quite extended) option package, with limited choice of “additional” options.
- Allmost all with a 383, but:
- At least one of them was a Hemi, reported in the USA (for sale around 1998).
- The cars all had chrome Simca “sports-mirrors”. They were not realy sexy and it is understandable the previous owner changed them for real racingmirrors as soon as he could find a pair. I do have these mirrors in my livingroom, they say: “Licence Talbot”. I will make a picture of them.
- 280 made. Another source stated “more than 300 or allmost 400 made”.
I have been looking on the web for these french made cars, but found hardly any info. I hope to be able to find out about these French-assembled cars and their whereabouts in order to make sure my car is original.
The car was imported in the Netherlands in the winter of 1971 (The registration number is of 1972, januari 27).
(I know there were also made some Mopars in Switserland (A-body’s?), Sweden and even the Netherlands (a Valiant “made in the Netherlands” has been reported).
My Challenger is dressed as follows:
-2-door Hardtop
-383 (4 bbl Magnum, according to the option sheet only available on a R/T car…??).
-727 Torqueflite
-slapstick
-Rally instrument panel cluster (with vairable –speed wipers, electric washers, tach and clock. Or is the Rally dash allways “full” like this? Anyway, the clock works! Ok, ok, at aproximately 63 minutes per hour
)
-Twin Snorkle air cleaner (came with 4bbl)
-Center console
-3.23 axle Ratio
-8 ¾ Rear Axle
-Sure-Grip
-firm ride suspension (Extra springs)
-additional coil springs in front (maybe this was mandatory with B/RB engines)
-one but thickest torsion bar versions (hemi engines needed thickest, maybe this was mandatory with B/RB engines)
-(Power) Disc brakes
-Power steering
-Power windows
-“Deluxe” (don’t know what it is called) steering-wheel with polished spokes (with the “triangle holes” in them)
-Wood grain door panels
-White paint (AlpineWhite, or for me: Vanishingpoint white
-Black interior
-Bucket seats
-Flip-top gasgap
-Bumper Guards front & rear with rubber inserts
-The “Big” type fenders to give clearance for F60x15 tyres (extra large wheelwells and special wheel lip openings).
-Hoodpins
-Original scat pack bee quarter window decals (in mint condition)
Maybe I forgot something.
Not original:
-Racing mirrors in body color. They suit me just fine.
-Flathood! It is said that something heavy has fallen on the RT hood one day, and it was mandatory to be exchanged by a flathood due to circumstances… Flathood with hoodpins therefore! I will replace it by an RT hood again one day
-Wheels: wolfrace (235 60/14). Original wolfrace, no imitations. (there appear to be manufacturers who imitate
them). I don’t like them too much.
I am not sure yet about the chassis options, but it seems that the car has all the R/T options, exept for the R/T badges. Hm, maybe they forgot the RT letters when they imported it in the Netherlands :-s
The body is in quite good shape, total estimated rust on the whole car is about a cubic centimeter, due to not perfectly prepared paint job 2 years ago. Since the car has been stripped not so long ago (I have seen the pictures) it cannot be a greater mess than that under the paint. The paintjob itself does not meet my standards but hey, that gave me a way to pull on the price. I feel I will have to do it all over this or next winter in order to preserve the car for the coming XX years, improving the looks as well. Maybe even a give her a Zinc-bath like Audi gives their modern cars. Allthough I had other colors (grey or blue) in mind when thinking of my dreamcar, white is her original original color, and gives her the ultimate Vanishingpoint-look.
The engine is totally rebuilt and came as follows:
TRW .030 flattop pistons, 906 cylinder heads, 268/284 Mopar Performance Purple cam, (At .050” according to Summit to multiply with 0.85: 227.8/241.4, 450/450 lift and Edelbrock DP hi-rise intake (Performer RPM)
magnum exhaust man, MP electronic ignition (orange box). All new parts.
New high volume oilpump, waterpump, flex fan, heavy duty ign. wires,
Cooling system is cleaned. Alternator and starter are rebuilt. Fresh Hemi Orange paint on the block. The engine had run about 1100 km since rebuilding.
727 Torqueflite was not worked on yet. (And it is about time).
Mint interior. (New bucket seats, clean dash).
Allthough I did some work on motorcycles (engine swaps, maintenance, troubleshooting), I do feel as a novice when it comes to restoring and tuning Challengers. What is more, I do not have the equipment (car lift, automotive tools and above all space) and hardly the time to do the big works myself alone, but happily I found a Mopar enthousiast in the neighbourhood who has this all.
In the months I have owned the car it is equiped with new yokes and a 2.4” dual exhaust system with flowmasters (type “40”, extra deep rumble). No extra mufflers. It works well and sounds great. But when I examined the car later I found out the welding was not perfectly neat. Winter had set in so I could not drive to the west of our country te complain… From now on I will be far more serious on checking.
Right now my tranny is going to be rebuilt. I am not sure yet who gets to do the job. Extra work these weeks:
ATF cooler
Shift kit?
Fresh door hinges
Cooling system upgrade: new core or aluminum cooler, shroud, maybe a overflow tank
In the meantime I have learned to very much appreciate the small and friendly Moparcrowd flocking here. This is one of the nicest autoforums I have ever entered. (mainly thanks to Dave’s good work). I will be posting more often from now on I expect. As soon as the 727 is ready and the wheather is nice I will make a lot of pictures.
Anyone who knows just a little bit about these Challengers assembled in France, or thinks he knows somebody who owns (or owned!) one, please contact me and this forum!
See y’all!
Robbert
I have posted twice last august about a Challenger I considered to buy (Technical/transmission/not so technical, thread about rpm) , but never really introduced myself and my car on this marvellous forum. (ok you can skip the personal part, and scroll to the Challenger part if you wish).
My name is Robbert, and have had this thing for cars since I was 18 months old. (This is serious!) I was a special attraction at birthdays, since it was so nice for the uncles and nephews to take me out and let me point out and name the cars in the streets. (My family says that out of the first 200 words I spoke 100 were car-related). In those years, since I was born in 19**, the streets in the Netherlands were rather scarcely populated with small and economical cars. Opel, Volkswagen, Fiat, Renault, (German and English) •••• (sorry, "furd"-wurd) , Simca, and others ruled the streets. When my father bought our first car it was a Beetle. The third car in our street, were now you can find maybe 50 cars. Cars were for transportation, performance for most people was a non-issue. Still I was fascinating by them. Remember there were no Japanese cars, and the different breeds were of very different build. In looks and technique. When I was 8, I could tell a dozen of cars only from hearing their engine, horn or even their doors closing. (for instance a Fiat 600, NSU 1200, and a Simca 1000 were all air cooled 4 cylinder cars, but I could still distinguish them. Opel, Renault, Fiat, no problem. And the only diesel engines in those days were Mercedes or Peugeot). Nowadays it is hard to hear the difference between most cars.
As I grew older an uncle of mine took me for a ride in his Rover V8 3500. Now this was something different. This ride made eager for power and speed. This was wat I would buy if I would be old enough! The rumble of the V8 added a new feeling of exitement. It made that I started to dream about cars. I mean in my sleep. (I still do, last night I dreamed about a ride in my Chally after having installed a shift kit...). Later I rode more and faster cars, but nothing exited me more than a big V8. Then one day I saw the Vanishing Point...
Chally
To make a long story short, after other cars (and motorcycles and, another passion that fights for my attention but is worsted after I decided to go for the real wheels. Not to mention girls, also very time consuming.) I fell in love with (since seeing Vanishing Point!) and started seriously looking for my dreamcar: a nice Dodge Challenger. Now nice ones were not easy to find! After more than a year I allmost decided to give it up and go for other Muscle… But then I came across this 1970 Challenger. It was a nice car, with nice options and its original rebuilt 383 and a lot of other work completed. Quite some parts and books came with it, the previous owner had decided to leave Europe.
The previous owner, who owned the car for about 2 and a half year, could not hand me over the build sheet, and the fender tag appeared to be missing since the last paint job! (The owner before him owned the car for 10 years without driving it). So I will be keeping a lookout for previous owners of Challengers, maybe this man is keeping it as a trophy, there were times it was not so much an issue… The owner stated the car is very much orinal, exept for wheels, hood, and mirrors. 99.000km (some 60.000 miles). Engine and tranny have 1970 #s indeed.
France
The car is of rare origin: The car is assembled in France. All information I have got about this is from hearsay:
- All Alpine White.
- They have a strange VIN code number, without the letters. The Fender tags were not in the same color as the inner fender but in plain aluminum. (could have been a reason to remove the tag before painting it). It also said: “Made in France”
- All with the same (quite extended) option package, with limited choice of “additional” options.
- Allmost all with a 383, but:
- At least one of them was a Hemi, reported in the USA (for sale around 1998).
- The cars all had chrome Simca “sports-mirrors”. They were not realy sexy and it is understandable the previous owner changed them for real racingmirrors as soon as he could find a pair. I do have these mirrors in my livingroom, they say: “Licence Talbot”. I will make a picture of them.
- 280 made. Another source stated “more than 300 or allmost 400 made”.
I have been looking on the web for these french made cars, but found hardly any info. I hope to be able to find out about these French-assembled cars and their whereabouts in order to make sure my car is original.
The car was imported in the Netherlands in the winter of 1971 (The registration number is of 1972, januari 27).
(I know there were also made some Mopars in Switserland (A-body’s?), Sweden and even the Netherlands (a Valiant “made in the Netherlands” has been reported).
My Challenger is dressed as follows:
-2-door Hardtop
-383 (4 bbl Magnum, according to the option sheet only available on a R/T car…??).
-727 Torqueflite
-slapstick
-Rally instrument panel cluster (with vairable –speed wipers, electric washers, tach and clock. Or is the Rally dash allways “full” like this? Anyway, the clock works! Ok, ok, at aproximately 63 minutes per hour
) -Twin Snorkle air cleaner (came with 4bbl)
-Center console
-3.23 axle Ratio
-8 ¾ Rear Axle
-Sure-Grip
-firm ride suspension (Extra springs)
-additional coil springs in front (maybe this was mandatory with B/RB engines)
-one but thickest torsion bar versions (hemi engines needed thickest, maybe this was mandatory with B/RB engines)
-(Power) Disc brakes
-Power steering
-Power windows
-“Deluxe” (don’t know what it is called) steering-wheel with polished spokes (with the “triangle holes” in them)
-Wood grain door panels
-White paint (AlpineWhite, or for me: Vanishingpoint white
-Black interior
-Bucket seats
-Flip-top gasgap
-Bumper Guards front & rear with rubber inserts
-The “Big” type fenders to give clearance for F60x15 tyres (extra large wheelwells and special wheel lip openings).
-Hoodpins
-Original scat pack bee quarter window decals (in mint condition)
Maybe I forgot something.
Not original:
-Racing mirrors in body color. They suit me just fine.
-Flathood! It is said that something heavy has fallen on the RT hood one day, and it was mandatory to be exchanged by a flathood due to circumstances… Flathood with hoodpins therefore! I will replace it by an RT hood again one day
-Wheels: wolfrace (235 60/14). Original wolfrace, no imitations. (there appear to be manufacturers who imitate
them). I don’t like them too much.
I am not sure yet about the chassis options, but it seems that the car has all the R/T options, exept for the R/T badges. Hm, maybe they forgot the RT letters when they imported it in the Netherlands :-s
The body is in quite good shape, total estimated rust on the whole car is about a cubic centimeter, due to not perfectly prepared paint job 2 years ago. Since the car has been stripped not so long ago (I have seen the pictures) it cannot be a greater mess than that under the paint. The paintjob itself does not meet my standards but hey, that gave me a way to pull on the price. I feel I will have to do it all over this or next winter in order to preserve the car for the coming XX years, improving the looks as well. Maybe even a give her a Zinc-bath like Audi gives their modern cars. Allthough I had other colors (grey or blue) in mind when thinking of my dreamcar, white is her original original color, and gives her the ultimate Vanishingpoint-look.
The engine is totally rebuilt and came as follows:
TRW .030 flattop pistons, 906 cylinder heads, 268/284 Mopar Performance Purple cam, (At .050” according to Summit to multiply with 0.85: 227.8/241.4, 450/450 lift and Edelbrock DP hi-rise intake (Performer RPM)
magnum exhaust man, MP electronic ignition (orange box). All new parts.
New high volume oilpump, waterpump, flex fan, heavy duty ign. wires,
Cooling system is cleaned. Alternator and starter are rebuilt. Fresh Hemi Orange paint on the block. The engine had run about 1100 km since rebuilding.
727 Torqueflite was not worked on yet. (And it is about time).
Mint interior. (New bucket seats, clean dash).
Allthough I did some work on motorcycles (engine swaps, maintenance, troubleshooting), I do feel as a novice when it comes to restoring and tuning Challengers. What is more, I do not have the equipment (car lift, automotive tools and above all space) and hardly the time to do the big works myself alone, but happily I found a Mopar enthousiast in the neighbourhood who has this all.
In the months I have owned the car it is equiped with new yokes and a 2.4” dual exhaust system with flowmasters (type “40”, extra deep rumble). No extra mufflers. It works well and sounds great. But when I examined the car later I found out the welding was not perfectly neat. Winter had set in so I could not drive to the west of our country te complain… From now on I will be far more serious on checking.
Right now my tranny is going to be rebuilt. I am not sure yet who gets to do the job. Extra work these weeks:
ATF cooler
Shift kit?
Fresh door hinges
Cooling system upgrade: new core or aluminum cooler, shroud, maybe a overflow tank
In the meantime I have learned to very much appreciate the small and friendly Moparcrowd flocking here. This is one of the nicest autoforums I have ever entered. (mainly thanks to Dave’s good work). I will be posting more often from now on I expect. As soon as the 727 is ready and the wheather is nice I will make a lot of pictures.
Anyone who knows just a little bit about these Challengers assembled in France, or thinks he knows somebody who owns (or owned!) one, please contact me and this forum!
See y’all!
Robbert