Hot Rod Project • The Dodge Challenger Message Board

by **Moparman1972** » 22 Sep 2008 16:09

So I've been working weekends on a new project over the summer now that my challenger is driveable. I acquired a straight axle front end off of ebay and have been assembling assorted other hot rod parts, and am going to attempt to build a rod from scratch. I made myself an english wheel and am hoping to be able to get good enough at it to do some custom panels, but we'll see. Everything will be built from scratch as far as the frame and body.

There are some pictures attached of what I have modeled for a rough body on CAD. I have access to this stuff through my work and this has taken up my lunchbreaks for the past 2 months! Its still pretty rough, but now that I have the bodylines down its just going to be trimming and modifying to get the right dimensions. Like right now, the motor intrudes on both the grille and firewall because i havent decided how far to recess it yet.

The body currently has no compound curves other than the rolled edges in the rear, so I'll be able to construct it still if my english wheel skills fall through.

What do you guys think of the body? I'm not really a hot rod guy, I stay in the 60's and 70's styling era, so this is my interpretation.

by **Moparman1972** » 22 Sep 2008 20:14

Here's a couple pics of the front end i have for it. I dont have the frame that's in the pictures.

by **dave-r** » 22 Sep 2008 20:47

My taste is for a original type Ford body (with roof chop of course) but then again I wouldn't dream of trying to make a body from scratch! :shock:

You must have some awesome metalworking skills if you are even considering this. I take my hat off to you Sir! :nod:

by **Moparman1972** » 22 Sep 2008 21:19

Nah dave, im just too dumb to realize im in way over my head yet, ha.

Yeah, I'm worried about constructing the shell, especially, which was why I left it all 2d curves, no compound curves really. Its going to be interesting......

Bondo is my best friend!

by **Jimiboy** » 23 Sep 2008 8:51

This will be interesting Moparman...

I love the -33, -34 coupes... preferably with fenders and a bit of chopped roof... But i dont think i ever seen a hot rod i did'nt like... it is cool how a type of car can be endlessly varied in so many styles and shapes... A Hot Rod is always cool! :thumbsup:

by **fal308** » 23 Sep 2008 15:12

First off, awesome project :thumbsup:

I think you're going to have compound curves whether you intend to or not as your lower body side panels will need to be rolled under the car. The roof should also have a bow in it to keep it from collapsing due to pressure differentials.
Start researching rat rods, as that appears (to me at least) to be the direction you're heading. Not to mention with a rat rod, if you mess up you can always say you meant it to be that way :mrgreen:

The easiest build would most likely be a rat rod roadster

by **Moparman1972** » 24 Sep 2008 0:45

Thanks for the feedback! Fal, I'm actually trying to steer away from the rat rod styling, id love this to be a clean show car all around. I was going to do a double firewall to hide all the engine compartment components and do a double floor deal too, so the frame and exhaust and rear end are all covered by smooth stainless panels with some quick release pins or something.

I'm constructing a frame from tubing for it, and I had planned a full rollcage kind of deal, so I think i might be able to get away with large diameter tubing blended to sheet metal for rolling the lower edges of the body, and in the rear where the trunk lines curve back. Sort of an exoskeleton in some areas.

The roof is what I'm most worried about! That will be difficult. I am trying to snag a coworker from the aerospace company where i work, as he's an expert tin-knocker, and he could put this together in his sleep.

This thing is going to be mostly mopar, too! An 8 3/4 rear, a 400 dual-quad big block, and some leftover B- and E-body parts will all be contributing!

by **dave-r** » 24 Sep 2008 8:24

I hope the build will be well documented with plenty of photographs here. :thumbsup:

But don't just show us the good bits. Make sure you document the bits you are not so happy about as well. There are bound to be some mistakes along the way and these can be more instructive and interesting than the bits that went well. :nod:

I still hope to build a Mopar powered '32 one day. Maybe during retirement if I can keep fit enough.

Think I will buy a body and chassis to start with though. I am not as brave as you. :lol:

by **fal308** » 24 Sep 2008 14:37

For the roof, you could hit up a junkyard and start measuring roofs. There should be something with the profile you're looking for. Then it would be quite a bit easier to modify the cutoff roof to suit your needs.
Maybe even a ribbed roof!

by **Moparman1972** » 25 Sep 2008 20:05

Hey, good idea Fal!

Ribbed roof? You mean like the batmobile?

by **dave-r** » 25 Sep 2008 20:52

Or ribbed for extra pleasure? :lol:

by **Moparman1972** » 25 Sep 2008 22:03

Updated: My little brother's interpretation of fal's idea.

Not much batman left to it, is there? :s006:

by **fal308** » 26 Sep 2008 14:37

Quite a few station wagons from the 1950s to the 1970s had small ribs running the length of the roof. I believe some Japanese cars, like the Datsun wagon ?, had them also. I think some fullsize vans had them also.
I'll try and find a pic or two
The ribs would add rigidity to your roof and give it a different look. You could also use a bead roller, though that will give you a smaller rib.

by **fal308** » 26 Sep 2008 14:52

Hopefully you can see the roof ribs in this ad.

by **Moparman1972** » 26 Sep 2008 16:16

Ah, I was thinking you meant just ribs underneath. I'll have to mess around with the cad model and see how they look.

I'll post pictures after I model it.

by **Eddie** » 26 Sep 2008 17:58

Dig this Rat Rod! It's all Dodge Too! :lol:

I'm not what you would call a hot rod person, but this is way cool! :thumbsup:

My ol lady's mame is betty, I call er "Bouncing Betty" (After the Lethal Viet-Cong Booby Trap) :lol:

by **Eddie** » 26 Sep 2008 18:02

by **Eddie** » 26 Sep 2008 18:03

by **Eddie** » 26 Sep 2008 18:05

Think the dude was "into" aircraft? LOL

by **fal308** » 26 Sep 2008 19:31

Was out and about and saw that many min-vans have the ribbed roof, if you're interested. An older Caravan roof would probably be near the size you need. If you don't want a ribbed roof, some other mini-van roof may still work

by **Moparman1972** » 26 Sep 2008 20:09

airfuelEddie wrote:Dig this Rat Rod! It's all Dodge Too! I'm not what you would call a hot rod person, but this is way cool! My ol lady's mame is betty, I call er "Bouncing Betty" (After the Lethal Viet-Cong Booby Trap)

Eddie, you must be PSYCHIC! That's the magazine article that inspired me to begin this project! I saw it next to my usual mopar magazine and it piqued my interest. The next day I started sketching out some rough designs. I work at an aerospace company, so of course i dug the setup of that car, but mine's going to be completely different.

Fal, i tried using my lunchbreak to model in some quick beads, lol, but Solid Edge (CAD software I am using) didnt take kindly to my attempts to modify the sheet metal and promptly crashed. Three times. So I gave up and worked on the placement of the drivetrain. The problem with a van roof to use ribbing off of, if I decide to go that way, is it is rather flat compared to my roofline as designed.

by **Moparman1972** » 26 Sep 2008 20:22

Here's some more pictures with switched out components. The rear end, front suspension, and engine are all their exact dimensions. (The engine is obviously lacking in detail because i didnt feel like grinding through 8 hours of cad work to model it perfectly, so I just created a rough envelope using the maximum clearance distances I would need for all components)

Axle to axle is 125 inches, which seemed quite long to me, so I also created an assembly with the front axle brought back 5 inches, where it seems to please the eye.

The frame is just a placeholder for the height at which the runners will go through the interior, I will have to design the front and rear sections after I finalize where the axles and engine will sit.

Any pointers are more than welcome, this is my first shot at.....well.....everything on this project sans tin knocking, and I imagine ill build each component 3 or 4 times before I get it right!

by **fal308** » 28 Sep 2008 14:24

It looks as though you have no rake in your CAD drawing ( I used a straightedge across the bottom of the tires). With that drop axle your front end will be raked compared to your rear.
Are you going to reuse jy parts or go all new?

by **Moparman1972** » 28 Sep 2008 15:40

Yes, I have not decided how to rake it.

I'd like to keep the rear end concealed within the body so it is covered by that rear panel, but I'd like to keep the rear of the car raised at least 2 or 3 inches over the front. Now that I have the exact dimensions of the components modeled, I plan on moving components around quite a bit to determine where I want them.

I am undecided as to what to do for a grille. The grille I modeled is the only one that seems to look right, but it is very small and it would cause big problems for putting in a radiator.

As far as parts for it, itll be mopar drivetrain, and I'm going to make as much as I can. Dashboard, body, frame, everything will be built. Seats I might construct, and I'll probably buy a set of gauges in the end. I dont plan on buying anything from a junkyard, I want to build this as my own style of rod and I'd rather make my own pieces before I put on original 30's stuff.

:s006:

What did i get myself into?

by **fal308** » 28 Sep 2008 16:06

What about a remote radiator? Running hard line to the rear and then putting a rad somewhere in back. Possibly a Vette radiator (angled radiator) w/ electric fans mounted under the trunk floor. That way you would only have a shell up front. Saw this once on a '33 with a very laid back shell like in your CAD. It looked good.

by **Moparman1972** » 28 Sep 2008 16:37

Theres an idea! I hadnt even considered that...... Thanks fal!

If I dont come up with a better design for the grille, I'll have to do it that way I think.

by jr » 28 Sep 2008 17:16

fal308 wrote:What about a remote radiator? Running hard line to the rear and then putting a rad somewhere in back. Possibly a Vette radiator (angled radiator) w/ electric fans mounted under the trunk floor. That way you would only have a shell up front. Saw this once on a '33 with a very laid back shell like in your CAD. It looked good.

Here's some pics and videos of 1971 Opel Kadett with rear mounted radiator.

http://www.cruisingnight.tk/index.php?o ... mitstart=2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r0XS1SPZqv4
http://www.cruisingnight.tk/index.php?o ... &Itemid=35

by **Moparman1972** » 29 Sep 2008 21:30

Thank you jr, that was very informative! I am going to mount the radiator in the rear after seeing this done in the opel, and since I am designing a double floor, I can run the hard lines in between there and keep them much neater than the opel. This is going to be a lot of water to move, so I am thinking an electric water pump is necessary?

I have run into a bit of a dilemma with the design, as there is not enough interior room as is, but if I widen the body, the rear tires touch the sheetmetal in the front and ruin my plans for no fenderwells. I am thinking some offset rims are necessary. This is all after modeling myself as a life sized lego figure and stuffing me into the cab!

The front of the frame is designed now except for the engine mounts, and I still have to get some measurements on the 4 link setup I am using before I draw up the rear.

I've looked up building the frame extensively online, but I still am really just guessing here. The rails will be either 2x3 or 3x3 square tubing, after some research. The rest of the skeleton will be round tubing.

by **fal308** » 30 Sep 2008 12:42

How would a smooth vertical s curve at the front of the rear wheels look? Not sure that would work but with CAD it's relatively easy to find out.
Or perhaps a wheel indent with a smooth transition to the body. You could use an english wheel to make the insert, if you have one or access to one.

edited to add that Harbor Freight has an Englsih Wheel for a relatively inexpensive price.

by **fal308** » 30 Sep 2008 12:47

Here's a Google search for rear mounted radiator http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=re ... q=rear+mou