[RedRaven]

Hey guys, aint been out in the car in a while as my brakes are like chewing gum at the moment.

I would love to do a fron tdisc upgrade but no mon no fun, so I guess its a rebuild job on them.

Any pointers and pics etc would be great. The right side one is pissing B fluid by the way.

[Adrian Worman]

You can get seal kits for the wheel cylinders Wayne, I got to do mine at the rear soon, may be able to do you another picture story

[RedRaven]

Kool, Im just concerned that I wont put the whole lot back together properly.

[Adrian Worman]

Don't sweat it mate, you can do it easy, have faith in Mother Mopar
If the car is off the road Wayne, remove the front drums and take 'em to a machine shop and get 'em to remove the wear lip on the outside edge of the shoe contact area, and clean up the same area it its got any grooves or scores.

[dave-r]

If the wheel brake cylinders are rusty inside (and I bet yours are) you will need new cylinders anyway. So pull a couple of them apart and check first before ordering a rebuild kit otherwise you are wasting your money.

[RedRaven]

I need to weigh up the cost of both redoing the cylinders and having the drums milled etc or just pay for the disc coversion kit? I suspect the drum option would be cheaper am I right?

As Dave said if the cylinder is rusted would honing them not work?

and guys what essensial tools do I need for the removal of the brake line etc.

Where can I pick up a retainer spring removal tool???

[drewcrane]

Yes it would be best to replace the cylinders,I looked up a set,they are $43.00bucks per unit,

and a rebuild kit springs,shoes,etc.$ 405.00

this from year one

http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/fbsh ... &SM=1&SC=1

there is a drum to disc conversion kit from ssbrakes $750.00 plus shipping,brake fluid,plane ticket to have Dave come over and help,could top a grand

http://www.ssbrakes.com/commerce/detail ... ?nPID=8804


Maybe get some new cylinders ,bleed the system, clean the old stuff up with some brake cleaner,and see if it will stop well enough to not have a pucker test

[RedRaven]

ok got most of the brake assembly off- some bolts at the rear are a real problem.

[dave-r]

Spring removal tool is a pair of pliers mate.

I would clean up the brakes. Emery cloth will probably take care of the drums and shoes. Get all the brake fluid and oily finger marks off the shoe surfaces before you put them back in. Use a solvent of some sort.

If the nuts on the end of the brake lines will not come off or round off so the spaner does not fit then cut the pipe off flush with the nut and use a socket to get it the nut off. But then you have to buy a good quality brake flaring tool to re-make the end.

[RedRaven]

Yeah when I got down to it I realise FFS that was easy no need for a special tool at all...sure Im special enough as it is........lol

I managed to get them nuts to shift, the 8mm spanner had trouble but the 3/8 worked a charm I tell ya..I have pics...oh by the way Im posting this right beside the car as I have mobile broadband..wicked....now where that cable so I can upload the piccys

[RedRaven]

Ok so I have the first cylinder off and one boot was half off half on..the other was welded on but both were full of brown gunk...sludge...I will need compressed air to remove the pistons so I will get a decent look at the inside to determine if they are knackered or not....I am still abit worried about the re assembly of the springs on the shoes etc....

[drewcrane]

can you down load pics? from your mobile broad band?
we can walk you though it for the assembly

[RedRaven]

I forgot the cable FFS.

not to worry. The passengers side one looks bad. the driver side is bone dry. I wonder should I leave it alone or if I do one side should I do both? Feck it I will do both.

As I said its just the reassembly of the shoe springs etc that puts me off.

[drewcrane]

Take a pic before you disassemble if you can, and you can use it to reassemble

[Adrian Worman]

If you do 'em a side at a time Wayne you'll have a pattern for how the assenbly fits together. Daves spot on about the cylinders, at that price it aint worth the hassle, just change 'em

[RedRaven]

Yeah did that for both sides Drew.

Ok major discovery. 2 things ok. The driver side drum is like chalk and cheese compared to the passengers side.

1. The driver side boots are bone dry, infact the whole set up is like it is completely unused. could the pistons be siezed inside?

2. When I took off the brake line connection on the passenger side it virtually came off in my hand and the driver side one is virtually welded one so I will need a spanner to remove it.

Ok so thoughts please?

[drewcrane]

You might need a fitting wrench dont strip the brake line fitting if you do you will have to replace the line,get some knocker loose or other penetrating oil,, I dont recommend using a spanner for that,

You should do both sides,turn the both drums, and get new cylinders

[RedRaven]

Ok so I managed to get the pistons out and I guess its bad news or I think its good as at least I found an issue. On the bad cylinder there seems to be major pitting inside the cylinder. I have a photo and I guess it means a change. the other one looks fine so you guys can see in the pic.

[dave-r]

That sludge you found is a mixture of brake fluid, rust and water. It creates an emulsion like that. As soon as you get moisture in the system it starts rusting the inside of the brake lines and then the cylinders. So as soon as you said you had gunk in there i knew you would find the piston damaged. Replace that one.

Brake fluid absorbs moisture from the air over time. Which is why you need to replace it every few years.

[RedRaven]

Im gonna take them home and clean then to show the pitting. I reckon I can save one at least for a spare.

I think Ive been struck with a previous owners quick fix lads. One of the boots on the poor cylinder appears to have been very well glued to the cylinder as I couldnt get the damn thing off, the rest came off easy enough.

[drewcrane]

Yea you get the parts and you have the pics , that ought to work

[RedRaven]

Ive posted the pics I took above,check em out

[RedRaven]

http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/fbsh ... &SM=1&SC=1

:

Having trouble pinpointing the cylinders mate, do A & B body set up fit E bodies?

[Adrian Worman]

You'll get them from a parts supplier here Wayne, pretty standard stock, try e-bay or USAutomotive save you time and cash
Check this page from Jims, shows good pix of the assembly and says that 70-72 B and E body cylinders are the same, rebuild kits are cheaper too
http://www.jimsautoparts.com/brake.htm

[Eddie]

Wow, Wayne,, those are pretty nasty. I'm sure you might already know this but I figure I should mention it just in case. When you took the shoes off, there is a long one and short one. The shoes may be the same length but it's the friction surface I'm talking about. The shorter of the friction surface is the primary shoe, it always goes to the front of the wheel. The longer goes to the rear and is the secondary shoe. I would also get a new spring kit if your springs are rusty, they are cheap and if they fail,,the brake shoes will be quickly damaged. As far as brake shoes if you can and they are available, and you can afford them I would try and get the bonded/molded shoes or the rivited ones. They are much better quality and wont break apart from the heat like the rivted shoes. On your drums, there is a number cast into the sides of the drum,,it will say something like 10.500 this means that if measured and they are say 10.495 that you will only have .005 (Thousands), of material left before you reach the maximum Inside diameter of the drum. Unfortunately this is not enough material to remove to true the drums up and you will have to get new ones. maybe they have plenty of material left? Good luck Bro,, hope this helps. Slayer or Led Zepplin,(Dazed & Confused) should be on when you work on it.

[RedRaven]

I mentioned that the driver side picture seemed some what used and the small piece that engages the star wheel didnt sit flush and seemed to just hang. what could be wrong here

[Eddie]

http://www.yearone.com/serverfiles/fbsh ... &SM=1&SC=1

:

Having trouble pinpointing the cylinders mate, do A & B body set up fit E bodies?

There are 3 sizes for 9,10,11 inch drum brakes. What size are your drums? 10 inch I think.

[RedRaven]

Im not sure Eddie, I got to check, they may be 11s as the car is an R/T and I believe that was the option for drums with R/Ts

[drewcrane]

I mentioned that the driver side picture seemed some what used and the small piece that engages the star wheel didnt sit flush and seemed to just hang. what could be wrong here

once you get things put back together post some more pix ,

I remember you talking about that so wait till you get the correct cylinders then you can see it it still hangs

[drewcrane]

I mentioned that the driver side picture seemed some what used and the small piece that engages the star wheel didnt sit flush and seemed to just hang. what could be wrong here

I see what you are talking about in one of your pix the adjuster is not touching the star wheel it looks like the spring is bent and needs to be bent back just so it holds the star wheel in place comprehende?