The Dodge Challenger Message Board

I hate that little circlip.

I did a quick reveiw of these pics and decided they were'nt too bad after all, if you think they're shit Fabien I'll try and do some more
I stripped and thoroughly cleaned the dist before I started, but it mainly made it easier to photograph. You'll have to bare with me because I can't work out how to move the pics around the text, so I've had to post several replies, sorry

This pic shows the original springs, the big green one gets discarded. Keep the smaller light one tho', I happily yanked it away before reading the instructions, took a long time to find it!

Here you can see the stock light spring and the shiny new gold spring, the chart that comes with it gives very detailed graph showing which combination of springs to use for most any given advance rate at all rpn's.
The other pic shows the F.B.O plate dropped into place, the differeny length slots clearly visible. I opted for 14deg of advance and the slots are clearly marked accordingly.

This shows the rotor shaft dropped into place, clamps the F.B.O plate in place. Other pic shows the circlip being installed, a bastard of a job requiring patience, something I was'nt born with. You can clearly see the way that the plate restricts the movement of the weight pins here, look at the edge of the slots and you can see the plate under the yoke of the rotor shaft.

Now thats done I install the vac advance plate, pick up coil and reluctor, making sure to set the air gap at 8thou. The vac can is next, even tho' I am following SuperDaves advice and omitting vac assistance, I still have to stop the plate from wobbling about. The reluctor goes on with a gentle tap, there is a roll pin protruding from under side of it, which lines up with a slot in the side of the rotor shaft.
And thats it I will go to a decent automotive tool counter and buy a proper set of circlip pliers, if I have to change springs it'll be a world of pain trying to deal with that bloody little clip

Great! Thanks.
Now I see the plate works the way I thought.
I'll get around to it shortly. I have just received the bracket I ordered from Designed2drive (HEI conversion bracket: http://www.designed2drive.com/ ) which allows to install a small GM HEI module underneath the distributor. I've wanted to give this a try for a while too.

What advance does each of the slots on the plate give you?

The round holes are lockdown,the others give 10,14 and 18 deg limit. The yokes on the rotor shaft are either plain rectangular or slightly angled, its important cos the angled slots affect the timing by 2-3 deg according to F.B.O's info sheet.
Firing it up Saturday morning

Thoght I'd better let you know how the modified dist worked out. Warmed the motor up nice and pulled the existing dist out, gonna tear it down tomorrow to see if it was stock. Dropped in the modded unit, pointed the can in roughly the same position and fired it up. Idled really smooth, left the vac out as Daves instruction, and pointed my SnapOn gun at the damper and this is what I found; at 2600rpm I got 32deg of timing, at 3000rpm I got 35/36deg, after that, say 3250rpm, I did'nt have any more.
Let the motor idle at 850/900rpm and checked initial, it was dead on 20deg, which means that F.B.O plate gave exactly what it promised, holy shit
Time then for a drive ............
Out in the 30mph limits it ran very well, smooth off idle, hardly any lurching in too high a gear, chirped or span the tyres a lot tho', pushing the pedal down just a bit too eager in 2nd or 3rd just shreds rubber, althogh the diff does'nt seem too good at keeping both tyres hooked up.
Out off the limits it seemed sort of urgent on the throttle from low revs in a way, like it would gain speed say into moving traffic very easily, just short shift it and in no time at all its trundling along at 60/70mph.
I did floor it in 3rd to see what it felt like, it pulled very well, still have a slight hesitation going to full throttle, nothing to do with the dist I'm certain, abd when it did start to rev out, say 4500rpm it was charging fairly hard. Bloody speedo cable broke but I guess around 80/85mph, whatever it all seemed vey easy.
Fabien is right about the feeling behind the wheel being a little underwhelming, the enhanced lower end response and power makes the upper rev range feel less extreme somehow.
Anyway I say I have made a good improvement, the lack of vac makes no difference to drivability as far as I can tell, started from hot ok, so I'll stick with it

There you go then. Easy wasn't it.

Yet it is very rare to find a Mopar with the timing set right.

My dizzy hold down is set just a bit loose so i can adjust on the road for the crap fuel sold here. Even the ol' reliable XR600 Honda now pings on premium "91" octane. The Stock 10:1 is marginal but I never had a problem before so what gives. Guessing to go one up on the main jet to run fatter and cover the ping.

I had been running a bit of AV 100 gas but it seems to make the her run sluggish so I'm backin down the timing and just running popcorn fuel till I figure it out.

Just wondering why the EPA (--> Calif CARB) messes with the fuel this time of year to reduce emmisions on vehicles. How does that help with pollution problems when a engine doesn't run right?:roll:

Jon wrote: Just wondering why the EPA (--> Calif CARB) messes with the fuel this time of year to reduce emmisions on vehicles. How does that help with pollution problems when a engine doesn't run right?:roll:

Modern engine controls will automatically adjust. You would need a fuel injection ECU which also controls ignition to do the same.

Or, when you can no longer stand the rigors of the californian winter, you can use a timing control to remove advance from the dash, so you don't have to get out of the car in the cold and back off the distributor... You need an aftermarket ignition (any MSD or Crane Hi-6) to do this though.

fbernard wrote:Modern engine controls will automatically adjust. You would need a fuel injection ECU which also controls ignition to do the same.

So a modern vehicle can tell if 87 vs 91 octane is being injected and subsequently change the timing? Wow that is a neat feature.

Did I detect a bit of sarcasm regarding the brutal winter weather here in California? Hell it got down to 80 yesterday for crips sake.

Jon wrote: So a modern vehicle can tell if 87 vs 91 octane is being injected and subsequently change the timing? Wow that is a neat feature.

Yes. My daily driver (which is already 8 years old) will run like crap with the local 95 brew. Runs perfect with 98. My 1991 Dodge Daytona did the same.

Did I detect a bit of sarcasm regarding the brutal winter weather here in California? Hell it got down to 80 yesterday for crips sake.

It rained here all week-end. Now it doesn't (too cold for raining, although it could be snowing).

I'll be sampling the harsh californian spring next April...

One of my local Shell stations keeps the very expensive high octane unleaded for track day use. I put some in my BMW sportsbike, cost a bomb to fill it up but it was good for something like 8-10 hp at the top end according to the race teams at Snetterton on my last track day .
I could feel the improvements more in response than any thing else
On a slightly different subject, if you get a slight pinking can just installing and properly gapping a colder range sparkplug help

Adrian Worman wrote:On a slightly different subject, if you get a slight pinking can just installing and properly gapping a colder range sparkplug help

If the detonation occurs on a hot spot which is the spark plug electrode, going to a colder plug might solve that condition. if the hot spot is somewhere else (carbon build-up, hard edge on the piston), it won't change a thing (unless it removes enough heat to cool the hot spot so that the mixture doesn't self-ignite). Going down one heat range is definitely an easy thing to try (the even easier and obvious try is to retard a bit). If the new plug fouls, it's too cold. If the pinging stops and the plug doesn't foul, the engine needed that new plug heat range.

On the other hand, if the slight pinging disappears with just a couple degrees off the timing, it might be advance related (too much advance, maximum cylinder pressure before TDC, leads to detonation). Either less timing or a slightly richer mixture should correct this.

fbernard wrote:
It rained here all week-end. Now it doesn't (too cold for raining, although it could be snowing).

I'll be sampling the harsh californian spring next April...

If you have the time look me up here on the central coast. Not a wine taster or par-tier but I know some cool scenery in the area.

Jon wrote:If you have the time look me up here on the central coast. Not a wine taster or par-tier but I know some cool scenery in the area.

A friend of mine is taking care of the planning (as long as I see mopars and put on weight during the trip it's OK by me ). Right now, plans call for Vegas, Death Valley, LA, back to Vegas for the MATS (we have to help out a friend from LA who can't drive all his cars alone...).
What's not sure yet is what happens after the MATS. Either back to LA before flying back or off to Florida on a one-week roadtrip.

Before the MATS date was published, we were thinking of starting with the March Meet in Bakersfield and ending with the MATS, but the dates are a little bit too far apart.